PA Performance 1g to 3g alternator uprgrade.

[SVOfish]

I just purchased the PA performance 1g to 3g alternator upgrade kit (PN: 462802C) and PA performance 3G alternator 95A (1614E) and the fused 4gapower wire.

My problem Is with the instructions PA provides you with in the 462802c kit. Hook up the new PA performance external voltage regulator, put the new 3g on, great.. easy. But PA has the yellow/white wire on the 3g harness with a ring terminal going to the B+ stud on the new 3g. Then they are saying splice the green/red wire from the 3g harness to the blue/orange wire on the old harness, which seems correct. Later on they are saying "the larger black/orange wire is the B+. instead of upgrading it, add a second wire (#6 or #4 gauge) to it, and run that from the B+ stud on the alternator over to the B+ side of the fender mounted starter solenoid."

Most sources I have seen , say NOT use the orange/black wires at all.

Also,on rothfam he is using the yellow/white 3g wire and splicing it to a white/black stripe stator wire from the old harness.

I bought the pa performance external voltage reg. because I did not want to make jumper wires in the old harness like othe write-ups suggest.

So all together PA has 3 wires at the b+ std on the new 3g, the yellow/white, the old blk/org and the new 4ga fused power wire going to the starter sol.

So, how did you all go about wiring this up?

[brsvo]

I jumped the old plug and it has worked for 5 years so far.

[SVOfish]

I just bought the pa performance voltage regulator instead of jumping the old regulator plug. I'm more concerned about pa performance wiring method of utilizing the old black/orange wire, yellow/white wire, and a 4G fused wire all piggybacking on the b+ terminal on the new 3g alternator.

[Raven855]

The challenge is knowing about the external regulator used in the PA kit. Is it a direct replacement for the stock regulator? I made a similar setup using a dummy regulator on the 3G and using a transpo external regulator. I haven't used or seen the PA kit so I am not sure how to answer. Caroths instructions are dealing with a 3G with the internal regulator. The instructions for the PA kit seem fine though. Just add the 4Ga wire as instructed. Most conversions replace the O/B wire because it is undersized for the conversion. In your case, you are simply adding the 4Ga wire and doubling up. You shouldn't have any issues with this and it makes converting back easier if you ever do that.

[SVOfish]

I am not sure. I can post some pictures later of the pa performance regulator. I wouldn't imagine it's a aftermarket replacement since there would be no reason to buy it if you could just leave your old regulator plugged in.

[SVOfish]

Someone on fep tore into the pa performance voltage regulator and has a picture towards the bottom of the thread on what modifications it contained. http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthread.php?23471-Ultimate-1G-to-3G-conversion-guide looks like everyone is saying not to use the black/orange wire for fire hazard reasons, pa instruction state otherwise in order to make the amp gauge or dummy light work. Maybe I shouldn't have bought the regulator kit and just made jumper wires for the regulator harness.

[MikeFleming]

I completely removed the stock, external regulator with my PS 3G 95Amp installation. Used their fused (200Amp) cable from the alternator output lug to the battery side of the starter solenoid stud.

Then I connected the voltage sensor wire, iirc white one, directly to the alternator output log - same one that has the 4gauge output wire to the starter solenoid.

This way if - for whatever reason - the 200A fuse blows, the alternator doesn't automagically go to full output, in a valiant attempt to self destruct.

Some pics from the Injector Change article:
http://www.svocop.com/Articles/1/PicsLarge/PCVValve.jpg
http://www.svocop.com/Articles/1/PicsLarge/StartPoint.jpg

Iirc the small gauge green wire makes the dash light work properly.

I probably have some more detailed alt wiring pics & schematic that I can post later on if needed.

[SVOfish]

More pics and wiring of how you installed yours is always good if you have the time. So you just unplugged the external voltage regulator and left it be? It's not a hard task, it just seems like there are 4 or five different ways idividuals are going about the wiring which is leaving me skeptical.

[MikeFleming]

More pics and wiring of how you installed yours is always good if you have the time. So you just unplugged the external voltage regulator and left it be? It's not a hard task, it just seems like there are 4 or five different ways idividuals are going about the wiring which is leaving me skeptical. Yep - removed the stock regulator and associated harnesses. Filled that area with relays (headlights, fan).

Iirc I used the 3G wiring diagram from Chris Roth's site. First up in the Red Baron Documents thread:

http://www.svocop.com/forum/showthread.php?2413-Creation-of-the-Red-Baron-Phase-5-Documentation

I will post detailed wiring pics later tonight if I get home early (and remember).

[SVOfish]

Thank you sir, I appreciate it. I will be receiving the alternator today if ups cooperates.

[MikeFleming]

Pics. The brown wire turned green - iirc - goes to the dash light.

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[SVOfish]

Is that brown wire the FLD wire from the oe harness?

[MikeFleming]

Is that brown wire the FLD wire from the oe harness? No. Refer to the first post and diagram in the thread linked above in post #9. It's the "I" terminal on the internal 3G regulator that goes to a 12V positive source when ignition switch is in Run position.

[SVOfish]

got it. The Roth diagram was what I was referring with the FLD (LB/OG splicing to the grn/red on the 3g) wire. http://www.rothfam.com/svo/3g/ I like your deleting the regulator approach better and will be following your diagrams instead of the way in the link.

Do you recall what 12v hot in run wire you spliced into? I am going to install tomorrow and will be mocking up a write up with your wiring method if you don't mind.

[MikeFleming]

I've slept since then but I think it's the same one that goes to the dash warning light - as shown in Chris' diagram.

That lamp gets +12V when ignition in in Run/Start positions on one side of it. Then when the alternator comes alive, and provides +12V on the green/red-to-brown wire, both sides of the dash warning light have +12V and it goes out.

[Raven855]

I went and revisited some of my wiring info. I was wrong about the black/orange wire and using it. It should be eliminated and not used. The reason is, if it is connected along with your new fused 4 gage wire it provides an additional path for the charging system. If the fuse on your new wire were to blow, suddenly you have the charging system loading the smaller wire and instead of blowing the fuse link you could easily overload the wire and it could burn and cause a fire instead of blowing.

The advantage of using the 3G with an internal regulator over an external regulator is load response control(LRC). An example of LRC is idling and you step on the brakes, turn on the AC, a high power stereo or anything that creates a load on the system, the alternator will immediately up the charge to compensate for the increased load. With the old 2G setup it is possible to turn everything on and actually discharge the battery.

Another item you should consider is upgrading the grounding system to match the charging system. If you are using a 4Ga wire with the charging side, use a new 4Ga or larger ground wire.

[SVOfish]

I am needing to do the ground as well. When I took the engine out to rebuild it there was no engine to chassis ground at all. I believe the original engine to chassis ground is at the RF of the engine and the battery negative cable goes to the lf of the engine correct?

[MikeFleming]

The original battery/engine electrical ground comes from the negative battery terminal, with a pigtail (~12-10 Ga) to the front inner fender near the battery, then down and over to the rear most of the two lower PS bracket bolts.

Additionally there is the braided signal ground wire that goes from the upper rear of the bell housing (which side depends on whether it's a CP or not!) to the firewall.

[SVOfish]

My braided signal ground wire is the one that's missing then. Obviously have the battery to engine w/10g pigtail, I saw in my grounds distribution diagram a rf of block to chassis ground. Diagram was from all data (somedata) so who knows if it's correct or not.

[SVOfish]

3g is installed, updated picture in my build thread "project tax return" thanks for the help!

[Raven855]

My braided signal ground wire is the one that's missing then. Obviously have the battery to engine w/10g pigtail, I saw in my grounds distribution diagram a rf of block to chassis ground. Diagram was from all data (somedata) so who knows if it's correct or not.Are you asking about the ground that is on the firewall by the back of the engine?

[MikeFleming]

Are you asking about the ground that is on the firewall by the back of the engine? This here newly-made braided wire. I have a small spool of makins somewhere. Iirc the length of this strap, non-CP version, is in the Red Baron Documentation thread.

Note: Be sure to remove paint from the firewall for good electrical contact. The rough edged star washer end lug gets smoothed and flattened over the decades and won't always cut through fresh paint. Small end goes to firewall, large end goes to top bolt on bell housing to block.

NOTE: Comp Prep cars have this ground on the drives side of the two upper bell housing bolts and non-CP have it on the passenger side. Who knows why.
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[SVOfish]

Good info! Thanks

[SVOfish]

Are you asking about the ground that is on the firewall by the back of the engine? Yes that's the one I'm referring to.