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  1. #1
    Building Boost
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    Question Koni and Alignment Settings for HPDE Event

    Good Day...

    Hopefully I put this thread in the right area as it is not really racing per say but not street either.

    After five years, 617 new parts and enough money to have paid off the Boss 302 (exaggerated but the wife thinks differently) I am ready to take the old girl out to do a few HPDE events for personal reasons. Either the car will go up in flames or I will be able to hang with the Miatas until the brakes give out. This months course info is below for a reference point and this a video of the track - http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=5RXGQO262Og

    msr31.JPG

    A brief listing of the major suspension parts are described below.
    Front:
    1. Stock Konis - new
    2. '03 Cobra FCAs with MM Spindle Adapter Kit - new arms
    3. Stock spindles and K-Member - refurbed
    4. Stock steering setup - updated rack, rag joint and MM bushings
    5. New tie rods and end links (FRPP)
    6. MM K-Member Brace and Strut Tower Brace
    7. MM Caster/Camber plates
    8. MM Sway Bar Relocation Kit and Poly Bushings - Stock Swaybar
    9. H&R Sport Springs (front and rear with poly insulators)
    10. MM Subframe Connectors

    Rear:
    1. Stock Konis - Quad Setup, new
    2. MM HD Lower Control Arms
    3. FRPP Upper Control Arms
    4. MM Panhard Bar
    5. Stock Sway Bar - Updated Poly Bushings
    6. KB rear shock tower brace
    7. 8.8 Rear - Updated FRPP Differential Cover, FRPP Torsen T2, stock 3.73 gears

    Brakes:
    1. Stock Setup - New Calipers on all corners, SS Lines, Slotted Rotors, HPDE Pad setup, MC, Power Booster, Duct Kit, Motul 600, etc.

    Wheels:
    1. Stock with Bridgestone RE11A 225/50/16 - scrubbed in the last month, about 500 miles.

    Engine/Transmission:
    1. Near stock - few upgrades, dyno this weekend at 222/278, rebuilt T5
    2. All new cooling system but it still runs warmer than normal.

    All that said, I have never run this car on a track and will be learning how to drive again (modded '03 Cobra, '12 Boss 302 LS are my HPDE cars) and dropping down to the Blue Group. The new "stock" setup seems weird based on not going a full SN95 setup for the rebuild my daughter wanted a stock setup. Unfortunately she passed away before we finished the car this summer for her sweet 16 birthday.

    So any suggestions on the following are greatly appreciated.
    1. Koni Setup on the Front and Rear - Soft, Firm, Extra Firm?
    2. Front Alignment (driving the car to and from the event but want a good balance on the track)
    3. Any last minute suspension changes based on the car's refurb list.

    Sincere Thanks in Advance...
    Help Wanted - 1985.5 SVO needs a full resto...

  2. #2
    Red Captain MikeFleming's Avatar
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    My condolences on your daughter. That must be tough.

    Set all KONIs to full hard. Tires to 32-34 cold, bring them down to ~36-3 when hot (an iterative process).

    Front alignment: As much caster as possible (5+ degrees if your CC plates will do it). -2.0/-2.5 degrees camber and zero toe-in. If you can tolerate a loose car on track, set 1/8 toe OUT. If you want more push, 1/16 toe IN.

    Get some semi-track pads and install fresh DOT 4 fluid, such as ATE 200.

    Have fun!!
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeFleming View Post
    My condolences on your daughter. That must be tough.

    Have fun!!
    Thanks for the kind words Mike. As a parent you never want to lose a child. It is the most unbearable pain one can imagine. Especially since she was in a freak one in a billion accident that also killed a close friend of hers that was also my son's best friend - http://www.anandtech.com/show/7188/a...wn-abigail-key .

    Thank you for the settings, it is greatly appreciated. As for the brakes I am running the Stillen slotted rotors, Porterfield R4-S pads and Motul 600 in the car now. I think those should suffice but considering the number of turns I am still a little concerned. I bought a set of EBC slotted rotors and Yellowstuff pads (also a set of Bluestuff for the front) as a backup and still have not decided whether to switch out the pads or not before Saturday. The car stops great on the street now but I have no idea how well the pads I bought will hold up over two days on that course.

    I know with my '03 that the Yellowstuff or Porterfield R4-S pads will make it through a weekend session even with that ship anchor on the front end. On the Boss 302 I get two full sessions with the Blue front and Yellow rear combo but the Blues are fairly hard on street rotors so that car gets separate front rotors on track days and sometimes actual track pads depending on the course.

    I am smart enough to save my brakes but not ever driving this car on track and knowing how it likes to waddle around I am honestly worried about what will happen here. My son will be driving his '07 Shelby GT at this HPDE also but it is his first time so he is in the Green group but his car was prepped by FTBR so it should hold together. I just do not want to embarrass myself with the SVO as he thinks I am nuts driving it. He bet me I will not make two laps before a wrecker call goes out. But I owe it to Abby as this car is something we worked together on for the last five years and she claimed it as hers last year with the intention of doing HPDE when she was old enough.
    Last edited by Gary13; 10-06-2013 at 07:15 PM.
    Help Wanted - 1985.5 SVO needs a full resto...

  4. #4
    Red Captain MikeFleming's Avatar
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    As for the brakes I am running the Stillen slotted rotors, Porterfield R4-S pads and Motul 600 in the car now. I think those should suffice but considering the number of turns I am still a little concerned. I bought a set of EBC slotted rotors and Yellowstuff pads (also a set of Bluestuff for the front) as a backup and still have not decided whether to switch out the pads or not before Saturday. The car stops great on the street now but I have no idea how well the pads I bought will hold up over two days on that course.
    I had a set of EBC yellows on my EVO X for a short while after wearing down the original Brembo Ferodo pads. Once I cured the noise issues for street use, I took them to a track day.

    50% fade by the third lap. TOTALLY worthless - IMHO - as a track pad. I would get 6-10 laps on the stock Ferodo pads so I was seriously disappointed with the yellows. Granted the EVO is heavier than the SVO by a bunch (~600 Lbs) but I was not expecting the yellows to be so wimpy. They did have a nice cold initial bite level though (higher friction level than stock Ferodo pads) but once they got warm (650-800 F rotor temps), they were done.

    So I changed to Ferodo DS2500 F/R for street pads and CarboTech XP12/XP10 for fronts/rears. Haven't tracked the XPs yet. That's coming soon though.
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  5. #5
    Moderator Bob Holmes's Avatar
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    First of all, my sincere condolences. I can't imagine what you are going through. Second, you won't keep up with the Miati, so don't even worry about it. Make absolutely certain that you have the engine warm before going out on track. We've had serious problems with stripping dizzy gears when the engine isn't warm. Do not run a thick oil to try and compensate. If you can find a way to cool the brakes, its well worth the effort. Please post pictures if you can.
    Enough of that, it was giving me a headache.

  6. #6
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    Smile

    I want to wish you good luck, keep us posted
    The Machine speaks for itself !!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Holmes View Post
    Second, you won't keep up with the Miati, so don't even worry about it. Make absolutely certain that you have the engine warm before going out on track. We've had serious problems with stripping dizzy gears when the engine isn't warm. Do not run a thick oil to try and compensate. If you can find a way to cool the brakes, its well worth the effort. Please post pictures if you can.
    Oh man, at least let a guy dream about staying up with a couple of MX-5s and Minis. What oil do you recommend in the car for HPDE? I have been running RP 10W30 in the car since I bought it. As for cooling the brakes, I have a ghetto, err, SN95 modified setup on it that hopefully will pass inspection. If not, it takes about 3 minutes to snip it off.
    Help Wanted - 1985.5 SVO needs a full resto...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeFleming View Post
    I had a set of EBC yellows on my EVO X for a short while after wearing down the original Brembo Ferodo pads. Once I cured the noise issues for street use, I took them to a track day.

    50% fade by the third lap. TOTALLY worthless - IMHO 0 as a track pad. I would get 6-10 laps on the stock Feroro pads so I was seriously disappointed with the yellows. Granted the EVO is heavier than the SVO by a bunch (~600 Lbs) but I was not expecting the yellows to be so wimpy. They did have a nice cold initial bite level though (higher friction level than stock Ferodo pads) but once they got warm (650-800 F rotor temps), they were done.

    So I changed to Ferodo DS2500 F/R for street pads and CarboTech XP12/XP10 for fronts/rears. Haven't tracked the XPs yet. That's coming soon though.
    Interesting, I have not had an issue with the EBC Yellows but have just been using them since late last year. I understand the 2011 and earlier formula was a dog as you described. I had bought several sets off Amazon earlier this year when they were listed at the GreenStuff price for a couple of days. Even so, I will go a different direction now.

    On my son's GT, we are using the Ferodo DS2500 front and rears this weekend plus his brakes were upgraded to the Brembo package on the GT500 with forced cooling also. I have always liked the CarboTech products and the Bobcats were always a daily street pad on my wife's BMW or Audi. The last time I used them they squealed worse than Ned Beatty after hearing dueling banjos. I spoke with Mike and he recommended a XP10/XP8 combo on this car with the Stillen rotors. I ordered a set and fingers crossed they will be here on Thursday. I also ordered a XP20/XP10 setup for the Cobra. He said on the heavier cars the XP20 is a better alternative than XP12 and that they were actually easier on the rotors and squealed less than the 12s.

    So I will have some thoughts shortly on all three pads after what appears to be a very warm weekend forecast and a long technical track.
    Help Wanted - 1985.5 SVO needs a full resto...

  9. #9
    Red Captain MikeFleming's Avatar
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    Interesting, I have not had an issue with the EBC Yellows but have just been using them since late last year. I understand the 2011 and earlier formula was a dog as you described.
    Could be that the yellows I had were of the "old" variety as I got them for free some time back. EBC was running an SCCA special where if you sent them a copy of your SCCA license, they'd send a free set of pads (F&R) to folks in exchange for running their pads and stickers on windows (stickers on windows, pads inside calipers for those wondering!). So I got a full set. Don't remember when that was - but it's been more than two years.

    In any case they have a higher-than-normal cold friction level that some folks don't like but I was OK with. I was just seriously disappointed on how quickly they turned to soft butter during track use.

    I read through their XP10,12,20,... listings many times and choose the 12/10 combo to test first. We will see and adjust as needed after a few track sessions. Gotta start somewhere and I'm sure they'll do much better at temp than the DS2500. That's the goal for now.
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